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Post by Cactus Jack on Jun 3, 2008 13:32:47 GMT -6
29 May 2008
A California lawmaker who got a communist dictator to harbor a cop-murdering Black Panther fugitive and accused the CIA of selling crack cocaine in black neighborhoods has become the laughing stock of Congress for threatening to nationalize the oil industry.
Maxine Waters (D-CA), California’s most influential black lawmaker, made the threat during recent congressional hearings with oil company executives. She said the federal government would take over their industry if they failed to do something to stop the escalating price of gasoline.
Waters told the president of a major oil company to “guess what this liberal would be all about? This liberal would be all about socializing -- uh, uh, would be about basically taking over and the government running all of your companies.” One renowned commentator, who said Waters made an absolute total fool of herself, points out that the congresswoman’s associates can be heard laughing in the video of the embarrassing exchange.
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Post by jeffolie on Jun 3, 2008 15:00:34 GMT -6
There is good reason that the American public holds Congress in such contempt. Waters is a wack job and there are plenty of wack jobs in Congress.
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Post by blueneck on Jun 3, 2008 15:42:33 GMT -6
Actually nationalizing big oil doesn't sound like too bad of an idea to me, we could use the proceeds to pay down the national debts and fund alternative energy research
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Post by Cactus Jack on Jun 6, 2008 10:45:18 GMT -6
..there's no way in hell, Congress will pay down the nat'l debt by nationalizing oil companies. To that assembly of bozos nat'l debt doesn't exist. As for funding alternative energy research, that'll become just another form of pork to be exploited by the elected officials. Besides if funds were to go to something worthwhile (alternative energy R&D, that is), I suggest it go directly to the States (not the Fed) and in spite of nat'lizing Big Oil, a surcharge of say $25 in automatically tacked on any driver who is stopped for speeding, graduated upward with each spatial increment in speed -- which will accomplish 2 things: 1. Fund the kind of programs Blueneck advocates, and 2. Punish the drivers with Lead Feet (which may make them drive slower).
Final note, if BigOil were to be nationalized, who will be drilling the wells? Will currently off limits locations under Fed control then be open to exploration and recovery?? ... and finally, how will the Fed refine that oil, unless they also nationalize oil refineries which mostly are not controlled by Big Oil anyway???
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Post by agito on Jun 6, 2008 11:31:34 GMT -6
by that logic, why not nationalize google. better yet- every year the company with the highest profits get nationalized!
1)nationalized corps don't pay taxes 2)nationalized corps either a)don't make a profit, so no return of money for the government b)make a profit, but that comes out of the pocket of the citizen anyway so we didn't really do them any favors now did we?
lastly, nationalized corps usually end up as monopolies... and pretty much function as such
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Post by blueneck on Jun 7, 2008 4:59:15 GMT -6
by that logic, why not nationalize google. better yet- every year the company with the highest profits get nationalized! 1)nationalized corps don't pay taxes 2)nationalized corps either a)don't make a profit, so no return of money for the government b)make a profit, but that comes out of the pocket of the citizen anyway so we didn't really do them any favors now did we? lastly, nationalized corps usually end up as monopolies... and pretty much function as such There you go taking an idea to the extreme - google and oil are apples and oranges. Am more appropriate comparison would be health care, countries with national health cares citizens pay far less than those with for profit health "treatment" And your monopoly example is a false dichotomy. Look at countries that have nationalized oil - the citizens pay far less per gallon than privatized oil countries - think venezuela, mexico, saudi arabia and most middle eastern countries My point is if big oil can't behave then it is time for the govt to step in. My tongue was partially in my cheek with my original post on this topic, however there are growing calls that I believe have some merit for all or partial nationalization of oil - if not that definitely some increased scrutiny and regulation is in order
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Post by agito on Jun 7, 2008 10:15:35 GMT -6
You're right. I pretty much grabbed a company out of the air. Healthcare does seem like a more appropriate comparison, but it's still an apple to oranges comparison in that healthcare is a service industry where as oil is industrial/mining(?). Tertiary and Primary "sectors" of the economy. In that light, the most appropriate comparison might be the whole agriculture industry which really comes back to bite my argument in the ass when you consider the socializing aspects of the recent farm bill. which are all oil producing countries. Nationalizing american oil companies would amount to nationalizing the refining portion. However, this did get me thinking, how much do citizens in russia pay? And would that be comparable to the US if you tried to adjust for gdp/capita? yeah, that was one thing that i left unsaid. "I read somewhere" (i really hate saying that when i don't have the time to find old posts), that the profits oil companies make amount to $0.01 on the gallon. If that's true, than that is one hell of an efficient company and nationalizing it wouldn't make it better. IF, however, the companies were hiding profits off of the books or overstating costs, then yeah, nationalizing the company would be a quick way to find out. But you still wouldn't want the government in charge of the company over the long term. heh- and lastly i sympathize, look at UnLC's reaction to my snarkiness. Still, it's fun to wallow through the mud to see what kind of revelations can be brought forth.
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Post by graybeard on Jun 7, 2008 11:44:10 GMT -6
Brazil might be a better comparison. 35 years ago they had no oil industry; they imported it all. Through several regimes, they worked on sugar cane ethanol, and began exploration for oil. Now, a large percentage of their gasoline is ethanol, and their joint private-govt company, Petrobras (PBR) is a darling. They are exporting oil, and have just found a 33 Billion barrel field off their coast. Since PBR is one of the few companies with deep sea expertise, they are also partnering with other oil companies to drill in the Gulf of Mexico.
PBR stock is about 14 times higher than at the start of the Iraq war. Just wish I had bought more, although it's still rated a buy.
GB
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